Originally Posted By andyll <<i hope some on the left wake up, now that they dont have to get their guy reelected and realize that we cant keep spending money the way we are. >> The problem is that you, and most other republican's, seem to think that spending is what is driving the huge deficits. That is not correct. There was a huge jump in spending in FY2009... main under Bush 1) The bailouts (at least 1 Trillion over 2 years) 2) The Stimulas ( 350 Billion over 2 years ) 3) Increased safety net payouts because of the crash( welfare, food stamps, FDIC ) But after 2009 spending has been flat. It droped a little in 2010 and rose a little in 2011. Obama has the lowest growth in spending of any modern president. So what is driving the huge deficits? Some of it is interest payment. 2 wars, Medicare Part D, and bailouts added to decades of growting debt is catching up to us. But the deficits are mainly driving by decreased federal receipts: 1) Bush (and extended ) tax cuts 2) Obama tax cuts. 3) Business tax cuts... many of them retro-active so the government was paying large businesses. 4) The crash reduced tax payments significantly. In 2000... tax receipts where 2 Trillion In 2009... tax receipts where 2.1 Trillion An increase of 10 billion per year. The decade before federal income was increasing 100+ billion per year. In 2011 federal income increased 140 billion after increasing 60 billion the year before. The economy is coming back. Spending is going down. Federal tax income is going up. Its not going fast... but the worst thing we could do is put the economny back into recession with huge spending cuts now. All numbers are verifiable here: <a href="http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historicals" target="_blank">http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/...toricals</a> The 1st chart shows spending and income in a simple manner.
Originally Posted By Tikiduck I don't expect miracles from Obama, but I like him, and believe in his vision. I still can't see what the Hell Romney was going to do that would have made things better. This nation may be in trouble, but it has put it's faith in Obama, with both the electoral and popular vote, fair and square! The sooner the stomping, whining, end of the world as we know it Republican brats can get over that, the sooner we can start to get the country back on track.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney >>>You remember the 90's, right?<<< What? You mean there was time before 2009? I think people have forgotten. Even based on things I see on my daughter's facebook from her friends. Apparenlty the recession, high gas prices and foreclosures are all Obama's fault.
Originally Posted By DyGDisney You guys are wasting your time trying to explain anything to those brainwashed by the conservative media. They will never believe you! Fox news said the only reason Obama was elected was because of minorities. This country is a melting pot and the old conservatives are freaking out because people with brown skin are taking over. Who cares?! Skin color is not a representation of how American you are, or aren't; nor is it an indication of how intelligent you are or how hard you work.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 <mrkthompson is EXACTLY right.> No, he's exactly wrong, as posts 60 and 61 point out with, you know, actual facts. <realize that we cant keep spending money the way we are.> See above. <raising taxes on the rich isnt going to make a dent> It's a start. As I said, when the economy improves further, taxes will have to go back to 90's rates on everyone eventually if we're serious about debt reduction. <and class warfare.> Considering we're just talking about going back to 90's tax rates... did I miss the Great Class War of the 90's? Were we all riding around on tractors saying "Hello comrade!" to each other? I must have missed that. Oh yeah. Because it never happened. <Im realy worried about my beloved country and wish some of you would get over your obsession with voting and hatred> Hatred?? Of whom? I don't hate anybody, including the upper 1%. I just want them to pay the 90's rates. Oooooooh, I'm a hater!! <based solely on gay rights and actually see where we are headed.> Based solely on gay rights?? WTH? Yes, I believe in gay rights, but I don't know anyone here who bases their votes or support solely on that, including the gay folks here. What a strange thing to say. <and will get serious, as every serious person in America agrees we have to, about entitlement reform.> We have to tweak the tables, based on changing demographics and longer lifespans, no question. But we don't need to throw out the baby with the bath water.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>We are screwed. Good luck with your lives.<< Let us know when and if you decide to rejoin us back here in REAL America ... or just keep stewing in your own prefabricated fantasyland on delusion island until it ruins your health. I hope you have a happy life either way.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan Right at this very moment, Clint Eastwood is out there, somewhere, trying to figure out how in the hell a chair won the election.
Originally Posted By barboy I don't know who is more delusional: those who are ticked off something good that Mit lost or those who are happy as clams over another 4 years of Pres. Obama? Both factions need to wake up.
Originally Posted By Dabob2 One could say the same for the "I'll say 'a pox on both your houses' because even though that gets nothing done, it's just so hip" faction.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>Both factions need to wake up.<< I'm really so tired of this stuff. Pick something specific and let's debate that. But this "one side is no better than the other" posts go nowhere.
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 Well I'm always going to think that, because in my eyes the biggest problem in Washington are the Republicans and Democrats. When one side goes crazy the other loses it's spine and vice versa. That benefits none of us. So until there is some real change in Washington this is what we're going to get.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>I don't know who is more delusional: those who are ticked off something good that Mit lost or those who are happy as clams over another 4 years of Pres. Obama?<< That's easy. It would be the ones who said >>This country is finished. The moochers, looters, leeches, and thieves have won - and you @$$wipes don't even see it. Enjoy your country. China will consume you.<< Post 41. Check it out.
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 I'm really so tired of this stuff. Pick something specific and let's debate that. But this "one side is no better than the other" posts go nowhere.<< They go nowhere because it's true, the truth hurts but people just want to think their "side" does so good and the other side sucks.. This isn't sport's it's our lives and right now Washington is controlled by special interest groups... Not just the Democrats, not just the Republicans, every single person in D.C. is corrupt, the sooner people wake up and realize this, the sooner our country can escape the mess we are in...
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 I didn't vote for President Obama again, but he still is my President and I will always respect the office. It's just too bad that both he and whoever comes along are going to be hamstrung by the idiots in Washington.
Originally Posted By barboy ///Pick something specific and let's debate that/// Fair enough.....how about the US prosecuting pot users and sellers. You don't like that one? Ok let's talk about the complete and total withdrawal of US military from global 'hot zones'----- immediately, not this out by the year(fill in the blanks ) based on incremental retraction. Not to your liking? What about public monies bailing out large corporations while the weaker/smaller economic entities continue to struggle. And then there's this very disturbing business of US power to disregard the most fundamental civil liberty: "producing bodies". Yes, Kar2oon very few household political names with the D or R label want to play with these issues.
Originally Posted By Kar2oonMan >>They go nowhere because it's true<< You have to talk about a specific issue. This general "they all suck" stuff is a non-starter and really kind of boring after awhile. It's an easy out, it avoids thinking a little harder about an issue, or perhaps considering an alternative opinion. It's like people saying "I support the troops." Okay, that's great, but how do you mean? Do you donate to the USO? Do you vote for people who want to cut veteran benefits? What exactly does the very broad "I support the troops" mean?
Originally Posted By WilliamK99 Not to your liking? What about public monies bailing out large corporations while the weaker/smaller economic entities continue to struggle. << I can answer that one... Because the weaker/smaller economic entities don't donate extravagant funds to political campaigns...
Originally Posted By DDMAN26 Gary Johnson who I voted for needed to get 5% of the popular vote. I believe he pulled in 1%. Why did he need 5%? Because if he did, that would have brought the Libertarian party into the fold in the 2016 election. The candidate would have been able to participate in the debates, would have received funding to run a campaign just like the other two parties instead of basically being underground. Unless they did a little research would anyone have known that? Of course not, it's not in Washington's best interest to get other voices out there.
Originally Posted By mawnck >>Not just the Democrats, not just the Republicans, every single person in D.C. is corrupt<< This is crazy talk, and I will not respect it, or a person who espouses it. How about this instead: There are corrupt politicians on both sides, but there are also good, honest, honorable people on both sides who genuinely want what's best for their constituents and their country.
